Talking About Women’s History: Six Questions and Two Answers with K.S. Barton and Johanna Wittenberg
K.S. Barton and Johanna Wittenberg cohost the podcast Shieldmaidens: Women of the Norse World. Both have done extensive research in the period, and use it as the background for their novels.
K.S. Barton writes historical fiction and fantasy stories of love and adventure set in the Viking age. The author of several novels, she explores themes of family, honor, and strength all within the backdrop of Norse society. When doing research on Norse mythology for a teaching project, she discovered the Norse sagas and immediately knew she wanted to write fiction about Vikings. She has an M.A. in Humanities with a focus on literature and history and has always loved to learn about history through stories.
Johanna Wittenberg is the author of the bestselling Norsewomen Series, the story of Åsa, a real Norse queen who ruled alone during the early Viking Age. Book 7 of the series, The Irish Harper, releases in March 2025. Like her Viking forebears, Johanna has sailed to the far reaches of the world. She lives on a fjord in the Pacific Northwest with her husband, whom she met on a ship bound for Antarctica.
Take it away, ladies!
First up, K.S. Barton:
What inspired you to start Shieldmaidens: Women of the Norse World ?
I love listening to podcasts, especially history podcasts. It’s a fun, easy way to get information. However, there were no podcasts that really talked about Viking women. The only ones out there talked mostly about men, and if they did mention women, it was only in passing. The default (as it often still is in history) was from the male perspective. I wanted to do something that focused on the women of the Norse world. I wanted their stories told, and for them to be given the respect they deserve. So, I reached out to Johanna, whose novels and research I admire, and asked her to join me as a co-host. We came up with enough topics to get us started and we dove in!
How would you describe the purpose of the podcast?
The purpose of the podcast is to do deep dives into the lives of women in the Norse world. We examine the stories of Viking women from historical accounts, sagas, and archaeology. From shield maidens and queens to farmers and priestesses, we want to uncover the varied and complex roles that women played in Norse culture. We explore gender roles, war, magic, marriage and family, and even the impact of Christianization on their traditional beliefs and practices, among many others.
In addition to talking about the past itself, we interview the women today who study and write about the Viking Age–archaeologists, historians, journalists, and novelists. By looking at the Viking Age with a different lens and asking different questions, these women have uncovered new information and have pushed our understanding of the Viking Age into some fascinating areas.
Do you think Women's History Month is important and why?
I remember being in graduate school and a fellow student, a man, asked me sarcastically, “Why don’t we have men’s history?” to which I replied, “We do have men’s history. It’s called history.” I wish we didn’t need Women’s History Month. I wish we studied the accomplishments of women in every history class from elementary school all the way up to graduate school, but, sadly, that’s still not the case. It’s important for everyone, women and men, to understand that women play a vital role in every society and have since the very beginning of time. Women’s History Month is especially important now that there are certain forces that want to go backwards to a time when only certain people could be studied and celebrated. It’s important that women’s stories are told and their accomplishments celebrated.
And now, Johanna:
When did you first become interested in Norse history? What sparked that interest?
When I was in college, my mother, an artist of Norwegian descent, created a series of images that revived the ornamental style preserved in wood carvings and metalwork of the Viking age. These designs are now incorporated into the covers of all my books. When Mom was invited to exhibit her work in the Oslo City Hall, she took me and my sister along. She introduced me to the museums of Oslo. I spent hours in them, especially the Viking Ship museum which housed the magnificent Oseberg burial ship.
What work of women's history have you read lately that you loved? (Or for that matter, what work of women's history have you loved in any format? )
I especially enjoyed the book by journalist Heather Pringle, The Norsewomen. (We interviewed her on our podcast.) I thought I had read everything there was about women in the Viking Age, but Heather's book explored aspects I had not delved into, such as female slavery.
What do you find most challenging or most exciting about researching historical women?
The most challenging thing I find about researching historical women is all the missing, inaccurate, deleted, or rewritten information on their lives and their circumstances. Assumptions made by Victoria Era archeologists still hold sway, such as beliefs that women were without rights, agency, or power throughout history. Strong women were vilified. Misinterpretation of grave findings is common: An axe in a man's grave is a weapon, the same axe in a woman's grave is a cooking implement. It is exciting that those notions are being overturned by modern archeologists.
A question from K.S. Barton: When you started doing research into Sigrid Schultz, did you realize how timely the story is?
When I wrote my proposal for The Dragon from Chicago in 2019, I definitely pitched it as a story with resonance in the modern world, complete with “working around glass ceilings, keeping the news flowing despite tightening controls on the media, outwitting Nazis in Germany, standing up against pro-Nazi sympathizers at home, and dealing with claims of ‘fake news’ on both sides of the Atlantic, plus a little bit of a conspiracy theory.” But I had no idea how timely it would become.
A question from Johanna Wittenberg: In the introduction to your recent book, Women Warriors: An Unexpected History, you explain how you chose which historical figures to include. Can you share that criteria?
It was easy to find historical women warriors. Choosing which ones to include in the book was harder. It finally came down to three criteria: definition, diversity, and sources.
1. I went into the book with a simple definition of women warriors as women who actually fought. That definition was sufficient when looking at women who wielded a weapon, whether they dropped rocks from the wall of a besieged city, fired a musket/rifle/machine gun, or drove a tank. But once you more beyond the front line and start looking at commanders, the story becomes more complicated. After much thought, I chose to include female commanders who were the rough equivalent of what the United States armed forces calls a “combatant commander.”.
2. I wanted the book to be a true global history, so I made a real effort to include women from many times and many places. I had plenty to chose from.
3. Ultimately, my choices were defined by available sources. (When you write historical non-fiction, if always comes down to the sources.) Because I was writing a global history I had to rely to secondary sources and translations of primary sources into one of the languages I can read. There were many frustrating hints of stories that had not been translated.
In the end, I left out more stories than I included. So many stories remain to be told.
***
Want to know more about K.S. Barton and her work?
Visit her website, ksbarton.com, where you can claim a free prequel to the Norse Family Saga series
Follow her on Facebook at ksbartonauthor , on Instagram at ksbartonauthor and on Bluesky at @ksbarton.bsky.social
***
Want to know more about Johanna Wittenberg and her work?
Visit her website: https://johannawittenberg.com
Follow her on Facebook: Johanna Wittenberg Author
***
Listen to Shieldmaidens, Women of the Norse World at https://linktr.ee/womenofthenorseworld or on YouTube
***
Come back tomorrow for three questions and an answer from Ann Foster, host of the Vulgar History podcast
In which I sink into Queen of the West: The Life and Times of Dale Evans
I will admit, I picked up Queen of the West: The Life and Times of Dale Evans by Theresa Kaminski with a sense of relief. Even though I knew Evans suffered personal tragedy in her life, I was looking forward to a mental palate cleanser after a month of reading books that took on tough topics from Black history. A biography of a Hollywood icon seemed like just the thing. Kaminski did not disappoint.
I went into the biography knowing very little about Evans: she was an image and a name but not much else.*
Kaminski creates a vivid picture of a complicated life. She introduces the reader to the often harsh realities of the music world, following Evans from local radio, to Chicago lounges, to Hollywood. She creates the picture of a career woman, who hid the fact that she had a child by her first marriage and yet championed traditional roles for women later in her life. She follows Evans through four marriages, ending with her decades-long marriage to Roy Rogers. She traces Evans’ attempts to create a career as a glamour girl, her success as a songwriter,** her initial reluctance to be cast in Westerns because female characters were typically overshadowed by their male co-stars, and her re-invention later in her life as a stalwart of the inspirational/Christian country music world. And she makes it clear that Evans was actively involved in shaping her career and her image every step of the way.
Much more than a singing cowgirl.
*I’m not sure I ever saw an episode of the Roy Rogers Show as a child. My local television station offered reruns of Sky King instead.
**Who knew? Not me!
Interested in learning more about how Kaminski researched and wrote Queen of the West? Check out this Q & A from March 2022: Three Questions and an Answer with Theresa Kaminski
* * *
Come back on Monday for six questions and two answers with K.S. Barton and Johanna Wittenberg, hosts of the podcast Shieldmaidens: Women of the Norse World
Talking About Women’s History: Three Questions and an Answer with Shannon Frystak
Shannon Frystak, Ph.D. is a first-generation college student who went on to pursue a Masters and Ph.D. focusing predominantly on Women’s History. An award-winning writer and historian, she is Professor and Graduate Coordinator of the Department of History and Geography at East Stroudsburg University of Pennsylvania where she has taught since 2007. Her first book, Our Minds on Freedom: Women and the Struggle for Black Equality in Louisiana, 1924-1967 looked at the important and, often, overlooked work of female civil rights activists in a Deep South state. Her second book, Louisiana Women: Their Lives and Times, part of the Southern Women Series at the University of Georgia Press, is a collection of essays co-edited with her friend, Mary Farmer-Kaiser. She is widely published in a number of collections and journals and is currently working on a book about Lucille Watson, a plantation owner in Tensas Parish, Louisiana.
Take it away, Shannon
When did you first become interested in women's history? What sparked that interest?
I always knew that I wanted to be an academic, in some capacity, but as I had worked full-time to put myself through undergraduate school at Bowling Green State University, my grades were less than stellar and I decided to take some time off before deciding on a career long-term. After traveling across country, living in Washington, D.C. and working as a waitress while I volunteered at the Community for Creative Non-Violence, a homeless shelter/advocacy program, I moved to New Orleans and it was here that I began researching programs that might interest me; it felt like there were so many possibilities. One day I was perusing the Peterson’s Guide to Graduate Programs and happened to notice that Sarah Lawrence had a Master’s program in Women’s History. One of my favorite classes as an undergraduate student was my Women’s Studies course and I had long been an activist, attending many a women’s march in our nation’s capitol. So, I gave it a shot and I applied. And I got in! However, being that my undergraduate GPA wasn’t up to par, mainly because I worked full-time as a bartender to finish school, they asked me to take a few classes at a local university to prove that I was up for the challenge of a rigorous graduate program. The class I chose was called “Black Movements and Messiahs,” and it was taught by professor and civil rights activist, Raphael Cassimere. That class everything changed – I began to do research into black women’s history, reading Nikki Giovanni and Paula Giddings, and this course led me to pursue a Master’s in what was essentially African-American Women’s History. My thesis looked at the integration of the New Orleans chapter of the League of Women Voters, a story I happened upon when researching the white activist, Rosa Freeman Keller. The local chapter of the League of Women Voters allowed me access to their records where I came across a thin folder titled “Integration.” That serendipitous find led me to expand my research and to what ultimately became my larger work on women in New Orleans and across the state who were an integral, yet overlooked, part of the Louisiana civil rights movement.
What unsung woman activist from the past would you most like to read a biography of and why?
I’m currently looking at the life of Lucille Watson, a white female plantation owner, who successfully oversaw the daily operations of her family’s cotton (and later cattle) farm in Tensas Parish, Louisiana, just over the Mississippi River from Natchez. Her life should be made into a movie – she was a young debutante who married her uncle when her aunt died, a tennis pro, an avid hunter and fisherwoman, an amazing host who loved to entertain and who’s Christmas Eve parties were notorious, and the chatelaine of Cross Keys plantation, until her death in 1985.
What work of women's history have you read lately that you loved? (Or for that matter, what work of women's history have you loved in any format?)
When I first began research in women’s history there was so little about women in Louisiana and writ large. Today there are so many wonderful histories and books dedicated to uncovering stories about women and their contributions to American history. Some of the best recently published include my good friend Virginia Summey’s work on Elreta Melton Alexander Ralston, the groundbreaking attorney and first black female graduate of Columbia Law School, who in 1947 became the first black woman to practice law in North Carolina. My friend Jess Armstrong, who has a Master’s Degree in History, has recently published some really fun and engrossing historical fiction – The Curse of Penryth Hall and The Secret of the Three Fates - set in early 20th century gothic Great Britain where the protagonist, Ruby Vaughn, solves mysteries in London, Scotland, and, next up, Oxford. The field of women’s history has expanded greatly since the 1970s and the studies of women in this country and abroad are numerous, illustrating how significant women are to the history of world.
A question from Shannon: What is something that you learned in your research/studies of women in history that was striking, something we wouldn't otherwise know, that surprised you or delighted you? Something that was completely unexpected.
I will never forget learning that Alexander the Great had an older half-sister, Cynane, who was also a successful general—a story that scholars of the period are familiar with, but not one that makes it into mainstream world history classes. When I first stumbled across her story I literally ran down the stairs, shouting to my husband “You’ll never guess what I found!”
***
Want to known more about Shannon and her work? Check out her faculty page.
***
Tomorrow will be business as usual here on the Margins with a blog post from me. Then we’ll be back on Monday with six questions and two answers from Kim Barton and Johanna Wittenberg, novelists and hosts of the podcast “Shieldmaidens: Women of the Norse World.”